Abortion

[Try Honesty]

Sex is normal, and necessary to reproduce. It does gives pleasure, which is in someway necessary otherwise people might not want to do it, and that would be not good for the population. However, many people have made up sick acts to do with it, like a--l ---. That last thing brings the punishment by itself since that's the main thing that causes AIDS, which is also a sign for me why homosexuals are wrong.

I also believe it should only be done in marriage and with one person only-- ever.

If I ever have a wife, it would be nice that I am the only one in her life and she the only one in mine, if you know what I mean.

THERE'S NOTHING WRONG WITH ANAL SEX. A MAN CAN GIVE A WOMAN ANAL. ITS NOT JUSST EXCLUSIVE TO MAN ON MAN SEX.

YOU CAN HAVE VAGINAL SEX AND STILL GET AIDS

AIDS IS NOT "A HOMOSEXUAL ONLY" DISEASE

ASSUMING AIDS IS A HOMOSEXUAL ONLY THING IS REALLY REALLY DUMB OKAY.

THERES NOTHING WRONG WITH PREMARTIAL SEX

HELL, EVEN IM NOT A VIRGIN

IF YOU WANT TO WAIT UNTIL MARRIAGE THATS FINE BUT YOU HAVE NO RIGHT TO TELL OTHERS WHAT TO DO WITH THEIR BODIES

-HOPS ON A SKATEBOARD AND OLLIES OUTY IN STYLE-

ALSO ALL CAPS BECAUSE IM REAL MAD

 

[Stefan Bauwens]

@nerdbot, knowing that my child would have a genetic disease would not have any consequence on my choice, since my choice is set to not murder. It is not the baby's fault it is sick, and I'm not going to punish it with death. I have seen several kids who are handicapped, but they never seemed to be unhappy. True, it will make a big impact on my family, since such a kid required a lot of care. So what? If I'd kill it because I don't want to take care of it, that's just selfish. I'd rather be a poor beggar than have the death of my child(or any murder) on my conscience. And since I'm a christian, I believe the Lord will take care of me and my child in that case.

Also, anal is bad. point. It may not cause aids, but it is BY FAR the best way too spread it. I'm not saying gay's only do anal, but they are the big majority. Even if anal doesn't give you a sickness, it harms your body. More isn't there to say about it.

 

[Kuribotchi]

It's not healthy at all. It causes STDs, which are fatal and uncurable. It is dangerous. Not doing it is healthy and moral. And even with contraceptives, there is still a risk of getting STDs. [source: (reliable) school textbooks and real health sites.] But I don't get mad at others' opinions...I just think they have an uninformed opinion. Someone else said smoking tobacco cigarettes is healthy, but that's not true, either.

And I'm not religious, but I consider it to be depraved and wrong.

But I don't like it. It's sad that they are indecent and sinful but at least I can say I am not immoral like they are.

I know you already said you don't think that anymore (and you're not the one who came up with that idea), but textbooks say that it is bad for it in relationships like that. Not only does it give couples a chance at getting horrible diseases, it can mess up self-esteem and cause bad feelings. And what is "... education"? I learned--and know--that it is harmful and you should never do it, along with smoking and drugs and alcohol. But I already knew to avoid it forever because of my sense of right and wrong. I didn't really learn anything else about it because it's something that you would never do. And almost everyone else acts like it's something nice and good. =_= How many members actually agree with me...? Dazz? Anyone? ._. No one?

No they don't. Do you really think that? Would you get pleasure from it?--People get life-threatening diseases from it. You already know that. Your argument is invalid. Only immoral people get pleasure from indecency. Those are the same kind of people who think smoking is "cool". Someone else said "--- is fun". o_0 Sounds like something a r*pist would say. Creepy...

And abort...? I deleted my vote. I agree with Stefan and Dazz in that it is bad (taking life like that is definitely not nice ), but some of the others seem to be against morality for some reason.

I called it immoral, but is there really anything wrong with that? When I say people who rob stores and houses are immoral, am I being unkind? Am I supposed to "respect" people who revel in obscenity? Am I supposed to believe that something that has taken life from so many--too many--people, is actually good? Is it nice for others to promote harmful stuff? :'( I just shared my opinions and thoughts on something that I usually never think about.

People who try to stop violence--with violence. But I try to stop bad stuff in nonviolent ways.

is this post a joke?

 

[dazzilitchigirl]

is this post a joke?

No. But it's his opinion and violently opposing it won't do any good.

 

[Stefan Bauwens]

I'm not sure he was even opposing to normal s--, but more to masturbation, an-- ---, etc...

 

[Amat Gotchi]

@nerdbot, knowing that my child would have a genetic disease would not have any consequence on my choice, since my choice is set to not murder. It is not the baby's fault it is sick, and I'm not going to punish it with death. I have seen several kids who are handicapped, but they never seemed to be unhappy. True, it will make a big impact on my family, since such a kid required a lot of care. So what? If I'd kill it because I don't want to take care of it, that's just selfish. I'd rather be a poor beggar than have the death of my child(or any murder) on my conscience. And since I'm a christian, I believe the Lord will take care of me and my child in that case.

That is your opinion, and I can respect that.

However, there is the fact that not everyone will be so brave. Not everyone can afford to be so selfless, nor do they believe the same things that you believe.

Personally, I have no idea what I would do in that situation. I cannot know until I am faced with a dilemma like that, and I hope I never have to deal with it. I'd have to really discuss it with my partner and family.

 

[Stefan Bauwens]

That is your opinion, and I can respect that.

However, there is the fact that not everyone will be so brave. Not everyone can afford to be so selfless, nor do they believe the same things that you believe.

Personally, I have no idea what I would do in that situation. I cannot know until I am faced with a dilemma like that, and I hope I never have to deal with it. I'd have to really discuss it with my partner and family.

I don't understand you completely. You mentioned a few posts ago you were against abortion. So if abortion isn't an option, then what else is there but to keep the child?

Ofcourse, I will not deny that having such a child, or multiple, is difficult. And I guess sacrifices will have to be made. For example the mother staying at home to take care of her child(ren) (Please don't be offended with this, but I am of the opinion that if a woman has children, no matter handicapped or not, she should stay home to take care of it and let the husband earn the money), and finding a special school for it, etc..

 

[Amat Gotchi]

I don't understand you completely. You mentioned a few posts ago you were against abortion. So if abortion isn't an option, then what else is there but to keep the child?

Ofcourse, I will not deny that having such a child, or multiple, is difficult. And I guess sacrifices will have to be made. For example the mother staying at home to take care of her child(ren) (Please don't be offended with this, but I am of the opinion that if a woman has children, no matter handicapped or not, she should stay home to take care of it and let the husband earn the money), and finding a special school for it, etc..

Yes, I am against abortion. But I still don't know what choice I would make, because I have never been faced with that situation. I don't know, because I am not one to judge others who are in a situation I have never been in. I'd feel awful about getting an abortion, but on the same token I could have a child that had severe birth defects and whom I loved, but couldn't afford to keep...I can't imagine that predicament and hope I'm never faced with it. I might keep the child (I hope I would) or I might get an abortion and try again to have a child who was not disabled. There are so many questions to ask, and I don't know how much courage I would have.

And yes, if a mother is able to be a stay at home mom for the first few years of a child's life that is a very great thing. But not all mothers can feasibly do that. Some mothers have unemployed husbands or both parents have to work every day in order to make enough money to support their child. There are also single mothers who have to work because they are the only source of income.

 

[TamaMum]

I am going to close this thread (temporarily) and clean out all the off topic comments.

The subject is Abortion - Pro Choice or Pro Life and why.
It is not a thread to discuss the morality or immorality of various sexual practices.

When I have cleaned out and edited some of the posts I will re-open it.

Edit: I have now removed off topic posts.

Following private messages from various members of TamaTalk let me just add that I understand the fact that there are plenty of members who want this topic closed permanently - for plenty of different reasons. However, there are also members who wish to take an active part in a mature and sensible discussion and provided that all posts are made with respect to the site rules they are welcome to share their opinions.

If you want to express your opinion on TamaTalk you must find a way to express it within the site rules - no matter how angry or disgusted or emotional you might be feeling.

Keep it on topic please, keep it calm and avoid making posts that are provocative, accusatory or inflammatory.

 

[ForeverWaiting]

Pro choice. My body, my choices, so everyone should be granted the same logic of what they want done to their body. No one tells someone they can't get a hair cut, or paint their toenails or get that nose piercing of a tattoo. Sure people can object, but if some one really wants a nose piercing or a tattoo they will get it whether or not the public approves. Your body your choices. It falls on you to decide what you want to do with your body.

Every one has the right to free will, and the choice over what they do to their body end of story.

There is also no such thing as the perfect decision, on the one that is ideal in that moment of time, if the potential mother is a teen, and it was all a mistake, and they would rather graduate then become a mom when they are too young for it, then abortion is her best option. Don't judge people by their choices until you walk a mile in their shoes.

 

[Stefan Bauwens]

Pro choice. My body, my choices, so everyone should be granted the same logic of what they want done to their body. No one tells someone they can't get a hair cut, or paint their toenails or get that nose piercing of a tattoo. Sure people can object, but if some one really wants a nose piercing or a tattoo they will get it whether or not the public approves. Your body your choices. It falls on you to decide what you want to do with your body.

Every one has the right to free will, and the choice over what they do to their body end of story.

There is also no such thing as the perfect decision, on the one that is ideal in that moment of time, if the potential mother is a teen, and it was all a mistake, and they would rather graduate then become a mom when they are too young for it, then abortion is her best option. Don't judge people by their choices until you walk a mile in their shoes.

That's really the most silly excuse. Is YOUR body more important than SOMEONE ELSE'S LIFE. Remember that just like your parents don't own your body, you don't own your kids'.

 

[The Ultimate Doomer]

Is YOUR body more important than SOMEONE ELSE'S LIFE.

Maybe if they're selfish. They act like "Oh, it's my body, so I can do what I want and take someone's life, because my body is more important..." But I don't think like that.

 

[nerdbot]

Maybe if they're selfish. "Oh, it's my body, so I can do what I want and take someone's life, because my body is more important..."

No need to be rude, roll your eyes, and mock those who have been in such a position. This is a mature discussion.

There is nothing wrong with putting yourself first. That is different from being selfish.

 

[ForeverWaiting]

T

That's really the most silly excuse. Is YOUR body more important than SOMEONE ELSE'S LIFE. Remember that just like your parents don't own your body, you don't own your kids'.

One my parents would beg to differ, and two, not living until 3 months, and do you get all hung up about plant abortions? No one does, because picking flowers is a seemingly harmless action. Wrong it kills hundreds of lives all in one go. Every time you cook something you re killing thousands of living things. And you would rather have a teen mom not ready to be a mom, through her life away for some kid she probably won't love, the kid will probably grow up to be really screwed up and not have the same opens in life as the person who was ready to be a mom? I don't think so, it's a fetus until it comes out, it lives off of the mother, so therefore it is part of the mother until the umbilical cord is cut. And embryos, as it is called before three months are nothing more than a collection of rapidly dividing and diffentiating cells, and you kill cells every minute if your life. Besides you don't have a uterus. Again don't judge someone unless you take a step in their shoes.

You abort a plants life every time you eat a fruit, think about the potential chicken lives that could have happened with every egg you eat, and all those bacteria that could have lived but didn't because you washed your hands. If you're against one tourer against them all, life is life. And humans, are mammals and mammals are animals and that boils down to living things just like everything else, so if an embryo bothers you then, all the deaths around the world that comes from humans destructive every day lives should bother you too, and most abortions are for the quality of life of the embryo and mother. I chose quality over quantity.

 

[Stefan Bauwens]

No need to be rude, roll your eyes, and mock those who have been in such a position. This is a mature discussion.

There is nothing wrong with putting yourself first. That is different from being selfish.

He didn't say "because my life is more important", he said body.

T

One my parents would beg to differ, and two, not living until 3 months, and do you get all hung up about plant abortions? No one does, because picking flowers is a seemingly harmless action. Wrong it kills hundreds of lives all in one go. Every time you cook something you re killing thousands of living things. And you would rather have a teen mom not ready to be a mom, through her life away for some kid she probably won't love, the kid will probably grow up to be really screwed up and not have the same opens in life as the person who was ready to be a mom? I don't think so, it's a fetus until it comes out, it lives off of the mother, so therefore it is part of the mother until the umbilical cord is cut. And embryos, as it is called before three months are nothing more than a collection of rapidly dividing and diffentiating cells, and you kill cells every minute if your life. Besides you don't have a uterus. Again don't judge someone unless you take a step in their shoes.

You abort a plants life every time you eat a fruit, think about the potential chicken lives that could have happened with every egg you eat, and all those bacteria that could have lived but didn't because you washed your hands. If you're against one tourer against them all, life is life. And humans, are mammals and mammals are animals and that boils down to living things just like everything else, so if an embryo bothers you then, all the deaths around the world that comes from humans destructive every day lives should bother you too, and most abortions are for the quality of life of the embryo and mother. I chose quality over quantity.

There is a clear difference between animals and humans, let alone plants. I'm not going to even continue on that, since it's so ridiculous.

You say a fetus is living when it's 3 months? Why, because you say so? I can say it lives in week 6 because its heart starts to beat then, or even the first day because it is sure,( if nothing goes wrong) this will become a baby.

Also, abortion is allowed till week 24, which is not 3 but even more than 5 months!

This is not a situation you have to be before you can make a judgement about it. It is a very serious topic you best know much about so you won't make bad choices like killing your baby later on.

Also, naturally you cannot really kill your baby, unless you harm yourself; Abortion is not meant to be!

" And you would rather have a teen mom not ready to be a mom, through her life away for some kid she probably won't love, the kid will probably grow up to be really screwed up and not have the same opens in life as the person who was ready to be a mom?"

Yes.

Seriously, I can say one thing here: You reap what you sew. And if you have had premarital se* and it leads to this, it's kinda your own fault. However, teens can be ignorant, not well educated, and yes, some get r*ped. However, adoption is always a better solution than abortion.

 

[ForeverWaiting]

There aren't that many differences, they are all living are they not? They all have lives do they not?

And if abortion wasn't meant to be then how come people have been practicing it for hundreds of years in the form of drinking herbal drinks meant to purge the body, and the embryo my abort itself if it doesn't have the correct chromosomes. Abortion is very meant to be.

Alright so you'd rather have 15 year old girl who was raped (which you say is her fault I call bs being the proud owner of a uterus) you'd would have her life with the memory of that night for 9 months, give birth and then out it up for adoption without having emotional fall back? No, if that happened to my mother I would much rather she abort than have me. A constant reminder. If aportion wasn't meant to be then how come my twin was naturally aborted from my mother? God willed it? Bs. This is not a matter of religion, this is a matter of choice. I think about the 12 years being raped all the time, pregnancy at such a young age can kill, both mother and child, so the death of two is better than the removal of cells?

When you grow a uterus you can dictate what you do with it, my uterus I can decide if I want to use it to make a person or not.

Also pregnancies are not picnic, they can be deadly, I'd rather someone have an emergency abortion than die in the process for some women the process of pregnancy doenst suit their bodies, also did you know if the blood typed don't match up the mothers blood will kill the embryo? Food for thought

No matter what your say I have my opinions, I didn't make this far in my life being a push over in my opinions, I'm pretty sure the queen of England can't convince me to change my mind (and I think she is totally awesome even though I'm in Canada)

 

[Stefan Bauwens]

If my previous post wasn't clear, I didn't mean that for r*aped people it was their fault. I was talking about the once who voluntarily do it.

A baby dying naturally is not abortion by the way. When I say abortion isn't naturally, I mean that to do so, you basically must harm yourself, which is insane.

God put a baby inside you, so it's safe. But no, all the very person who has been given the job to guard it, goes "in" her own body and takes the baby out of it's room of safety to kill it.

I don't want to force my opinion, I want you to realize what for evil it is.

 

[ForeverWaiting]

Good and evil is relative and tied into opinion. And this real isn't a matter of religion so stop trying to make it one. Me as for the way I see who put the baby there, inputs not a baby until its born it is a mass of cells dividing and differentiating, I can grow the same mass of cells in a Petri dish under the proper conditions.

It all falls Down to free will and making the decision that is best in that moment of time, there is no such thing as the best decision. And again don't judge someone unless you have been in their shoes and know everything that impacts their decision, their health, where they live, income, age, desire to have a child, where they are in their lives, there is too much that can impact someone's decision.

We live in an age that I have hopes that will stop being so closed minded, it is not anyone else's really decision aside for the owner of the uterus. Yes the guy who helped can input, but it really does fall down to the mother. If she doenst want it, then why force her to go through with it? She has the right to make her own decisions.

 

[The Ultimate Doomer]

She has the right to make her own decisions.

But no one has the right to just take...a baby's...life...

 

[Stefan Bauwens]

But no one has the right to just take...a baby's...life...

Yes, it's obvious. And they always give the same argument; that it's a bunch of cells. Well, humans are a bunch of cells too.

EDIT: As a matter of fact, when children are born they're still in development. For example a baby still has more bones than an adult.

Or wait, even before becoming pubescent it isn't completely developed. ...

From the moment it's a embryo till it dies of old age it's still constantly developing and has not reached the human "full form", so basically you can kill a human with this ridiculous reason anytime in its life.

Also, I don't have to be a murderer before I can judge that murder is wrong. It's that simple!