Euthanasia

[Midorime]

Better to live in pain? I sincerely hope you're joking--I would never ever want to live the rest of my days in pain. You cannot live or function if you're in constant debilitating pain--it sucks out all the joy of living; you become this empty, depressed shell of a human being.

 

[Stefan Bauwens]

Better to live in pain? I sincerely hope you're joking--I would never ever want to live the rest of my days in pain. You cannot live or function if you're in constant debilitating pain--it sucks out all the joy of living; you become this empty, depressed shell of a human being.

I'm not joking. You should know by now I'm not really into jokes when it comes to these serious topics.

But it looks like we have come to a disagreement.

Also, if you kill yourself to avoid the pain, it's still murder in God's eyes. And therefore you'll probably end up in Hell, which is a lot worse. And no, God will probably not understand else the Bible would say that murder is allowed in those situations.

 

[robodog]

Well, it would be incurable if I'd broken my neck and had no use of anything below my head- at least, for the moment it is until we work out how to repair spinal tissue. I would be seriously limited physically. I mean, what could I possibly do? I wouldn't be able to get a job, feed myself, dress myself, wash myself... I've always been an independent, hardworking person and for me that kind of lifestyle would almost certainly cause me to become mentally ill, too, from a sense of lacking in direction and purpose.

And I'm sorry, but I have to disagree with you very strongly. I don't appreciate you telling me that loving music so much is wrong, because it's not. If you don't love something the way I love music- if you don't live and breathe it- then you cannot possibly understand how it would feel to lose such a thing. Honestly, telling me I could find a replacement is almost on the same level saying, 'Your parents have just died, but here's some new ones- they'll do.' Music has stuck with me longer than any friend, any possession, and it has been my saving grace through some of the most difficult moments of my life. If you've never felt that way about something, then I feel very sorry for you, because it is the most wonderful thing.

Although, I find it hard to believe that you haven't, because you clearly love God and being a Christian. How would you feel if somebody took that away from you? (obviously, I am aware that it's almost impossible, but for the purposes of this conversation, let's just say it could happen). I imagine you would feel like me in a world without music- lost, depressed, frustrated. But if you still feel differently, then I'm just going to say this- if it's so wrong to love something so passionately, then lock me up and throw away the key for the rest of my life, because I am totally guilty of that and not at all afraid to say so.

Music is also something that I shouldn't have to consider losing. People grow apart, and we also cannot get away from the fact that everybody dies and one day we will lose the people who are dear to us. But music, I hope, will never die out and never stop being a part of my life.

I do understand that it sounds selfish to a lot of people, but for me a world without music is a world not worth living in.

I adore this post and I agree completely. I live a miserable life. I've contemplated suicide many times. The act of existing is a chore. I was abused both mentally and physically by my father as a kid. I'm on disability due to a combination of anxiety, depression and Obsessive Compulsive disorder. I do not fear death. I welcome it. The only thing that I enjoy is my virtual pets. They're the only thing that makes me happy. Were I to lose them and be unable to acquire more I wouldn't want to go on at all. I already hate living. If I lose the one thing that makes it bearable I'd rather be dead.

And as for suicide being a sin? Why? If God is all knowing and all powerful why put someone in a position where they have nothing that makes existence bearable but then condemn someone to Hell for deciding not to go on? It would be well within God's power to make things better for a person. Why would he watch someone suffer to the point where they don't want to go on, yet condemn them to an eternity of agony because they couldn't bear to live anymore? This is not the act of a just and loving God. This is the act of an evil overlord in some cheap comic book. And I say this as a Christian myself. I don't believe God would ever be that cruel because if he was I'd rather complete cessation of existence rather than an eternity of life under the rule of an all powerful dictator.

 

[Stefan Bauwens]

Ofcourse I'm not God and cannot say it will happen. God has the final judgement and He will take your life into account. I can however say that suicide is a sin in God's eyes, it is not what He wants.

 

[GO-GOZARUTCHI1]

But remember not everyone believes in god... There are many religions out there and if we base all rules and laws in society off of one religion it wouldn't be fair to all the others. So I think if you want to prove your side do it without mentioning god or religion then I will be more likley to listen and if your reasoning is sound... Then I might change my mind on the matter at hand.

 

[Counting Bodies Like Sheep]

It is murder.

Euthanasia is just plain evil. It is better to live in pain then to commit suicide, or be killed by people who choose for you.

No man should control death, that is God's decision, not yours!

Without modern medicine, life support and pharmacological intervention, most people for whom euthanasia is perhaps appropriate wouldn't have survived the initial insult anyway. So if you TRULY believe that the decision to take life is in God's hands and his alone, I implore you to abstain from ALL inventions of modern medicine. Don't take antibiotics for your next infection. Don't have surgery if you get into an accident. Don't opt for chemotherapy should you ever get cancer.

It's hypocritical.

(...please don't refuse medical treatment if you need it...)

 

[HopeMcCarthyAuroraLovingtn]

Sometimes life is really hard and i just want to go far away from this world.

I am not afraid of death,but Death afraid of me.

I am just waiting till the time is come,and i'll be happy on that place.

Mr.P

sure i'll take euthanasia if i get a chance. Anytime

 

[Stefan Bauwens]

Sometimes life is really hard and i just want to go far away from this world.

I am not afraid of death,but Death afraid of me.

I am just waiting till the time is come,and i'll be happy on that place.

Mr.P

sure i'll take euthanasia if i get a chance. Anytime

I know life is hard, and sometimes the temptation too die may be high. But we must resist, because if we don't I don't think we will be happy in the place we go to.

You may not believe in God, but by killing yourself, which God forbids, you risk going to Hell.

Counting Bodies Likes Sheep, I think a human has to do everything in his ability to keep a person from dying, else he may be considered a murderer. Medicine comes from God too, and if we don't use it we are foolish. But stopping a life while there still is hope(as long as you are not dead, there is hope) is wrong.

 

[Eternal Mametchi Fan]

Well now, people do this to their pets all the time but does the pet request it? No. It is an animal's instinct to stay alive, and--sorry for sounding weird here--if animals could talk, chances are, they would tell us that they do NOT wish to be put down, no matter what pain they are in.

It is the same with people. People should not choose when they want to die. It's in the hands of nature.

 

[Midorime]

But pets are not capable of speech and higher levels of thinking like we are. They do not understand the concept of a 'god' or 'afterlife' or anything of the sort. They do know death, and in some cases they know when they will die and won't fight it, but rather prepare for it and then pass on.

Humans though, that's completely different. We can make choices based on reasoning, not instinct.

 

[Stefan Bauwens]

Well, I agree that there is definitely a difference between humans and animals. We, for example, eat animals(which is allowed by God btw).

However, killing an animal isn't per se evil or a sin, but can be when you have a wrong motive.

But as far as I know animals aren't really suicidal as much as humans are. Yes, they may be foolish and kill themselves, but that's something else.

And we, who are more intelligent, who should know much better are even allowing suicide? Well did Paul write in romans 1:22

"Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools," (read whole chapter: https://www.kingjamesbibleonline.org/Romans-Chapter-1/ )

 

[ForeverWaiting]

Speaking from experience, if rather have some one end their life on their terms than spend the rest if their life in pain, miserable, and just wishing for death especially if they are going to die anyways. I'd rather in be controlled than the person going to drastic measures to do it.

Would I stand by and watch a lived one suffer and slow and agonizing death? No, no one deserves that, that is immoral. And to be frank it's not anyone else's choice but the sick person. No one has the right to tell anyone wha they can can't do with their life. That simple.

Keeping religion out of it, yes every religion has their own views on the meaning of life, but still religion can only go so far. There is no person that has the power to dictate over someone else and tell them what they can and can't do with their life, should I get terminal cancer ( I truly hope not) but if I do, and the treatments stop working and if every second is too much pain for me to enjoy my remaining time with my family than what's the point? I'd rather end it than continue in pain and wishing I'd just kick the bucket.

It's not selfish if you think about it, I'd rather not my family remember he begging for death, after I'm gone, as that will probably scar my sister for life, I would much rather she remember the good times, the happy times and remember me with a smile on my face.

My grandmother took her life in her hands after countless strokes. She wanted it to end. She knew it was not going to get better, and she was done fighting all she wanted was peace of mind and I respect her for that.

I would have preferred she go easier than her refusing to take her meds, I really do, say what you what, I'm immoral, a terrible person going to burn in hell, whatever it's my opinion and I stand by it

 

[Stefan Bauwens]

If I can prevent a person to kill himself, I would try, but yes, I cannot control what he does. It is his life.

I can however, do my very best to make him change his mind.

The last days of ones life can be horrible, I believe, but instead of letting God take them when He wants to, they decide to take life in own hands, to be their own God and kill themselves.

You may not have a certain religion, but it is very obvious there is some Master brain(I believe it's God) who created humanity. It is undeniable, and if you do deny it, you're deceiving yourself. Really, there is so much wonder in the world, and your existence is one of them. Why be a fool, and risk death by your own hand?

 

[ForeverWaiting]

So being a biochem molecular biology student is deficiving myself in the wonders of the world? I don't think so, I see wonderful things every day. Where you see ear wax, I see your bodies immune system. You see sweat, I see proteins and ions, and salts and water. You see a human being a person, and all I see is yet another mammal. Filled with cells like every other mammal, with the abilities of thought as they all have, the ability to feel as they all have. Humanity wasn't created in my believes I'm very much pro evolution. Again this is not a debate on religion.

There are very good opposing opinions regardless of religion, I agree euthanasia should be legalized but with parameters, such as the patient has to consent to it, and they have to have a terminal illness. Not just some teenager who got dumped or someone in a depression who really needs to see a psychologist to help them with that because depression is actually a real medical problem.

Again not about religion, it's about the freedom to choose. Right now in Canada there's a woman whose legal binding will stated she didn't want to be supported on machines to live, and her family is suing the nursing home for going against her wishes, you can make your own des ions but you can't decide for someone else

 

[Counting Bodies Like Sheep]

Stefan, by your logic, turning off life support is murder. I don't believe it is our duty to keep people alive. I believe it is our duty to make people's lives better. There is a big difference between the two.

I am not a fan of religion but you have forced me to say this. God is compassionate, and no sin is unforgivable. I wish this was something you preached more, rather than telling everybody they're evil if they support euthanasia/deceiving themselves and going to hell. You talk to people as if they are idiots who make rash decisions regarding the meaning of life.

Humans have free will. May you one day come to terms with this.

 

[The Ultimate Doomer]

Humans have free will.

But they should not abuse "free will" for evil purposes.

 

[Stefan Bauwens]

Stefan, by your logic, turning off life support is murder. I don't believe it is our duty to keep people alive. I believe it is our duty to make people's lives better. There is a big difference between the two.

I am not a fan of religion but you have forced me to say this. God is compassionate, and no sin is unforgivable. I wish this was something you preached more, rather than telling everybody they're evil if they support euthanasia/deceiving themselves and going to hell. You talk to people as if they are idiots who make rash decisions regarding the meaning of life.

Humans have free will. May you one day come to terms with this.

Preaching that would be totally off topic here, and I believe it's just an irrelevant excuse to make me shut-up. Imagine a thread like this title "murder", and I'm talking against it, saying people will go to Hell and stuff. That's what God would have me do, I believe. Ofcourse you can repent of such things but before that happens people have to repent, eh?

And, I have preached that actually: https://www.tamatalk.com/IB/topic/184921-christianity/

 

[Counting Bodies Like Sheep]

But they should not abuse "free will" for evil purposes.

I was referring to Stefan's inability to leave people be when they express opinions that differ from his own. By all means, disagree - that's why I like these 'serious' threads. It's nice to read what other people are thinking. However, please accept that we can think for ourselves. I want to express my opinion without you blatantly telling me I am doomed to hell for my beliefs. It's just... common courtesy.

 

[The Ultimate Doomer]

I was referring to Stefan's inability to leave people be when they express opinions that differ from his own.

It's when people express immoral opinions that sound evil. Stefan simply does not like to see immorality and/or wrong ways of thinking, and neither do I.

 

[ForeverWaiting]

I was referring to Stefan's inability to leave people be when they express opinions that differ from his own. By all means, disagree - that's why I like these 'serious' threads. It's nice to read what other people are thinking. However, please accept that we can think for ourselves. I want to express my opinion without you blatantly telling me I am doomed to hell for my beliefs. It's just... common courtesy.

I agre with that, it is fine to not agree with someones opinion, if you can think for yourself you have your own opinion, but it's really not okay to tell people that they are wrong...Okay yes you can defend your opinion, but I respectful defence, saying the other is wrong is not a defence, thats just giving your opinion again. I would really like to see an opposing opinion that did not bring in religion and tell everyone they're all evil (as much as my inner villain likes it (jokes)) it's not respectful, and respect for other people is the first step to getting respect but this is getting a tad bit off topic there.